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    boards.hgtvremodels.com    HGTVRemodels Message Boards  Hop To Forum Categories  Best Practices  Hop To Forums  Exterior Finishes    Hardy plank vs. Vinyl siding.
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Hardy plank vs. Vinyl siding.
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I have a 2173 sq. ft. home which needs new siding. The old siding was some type of very thin "wood". The house has suffered some hurricane damage in the past years and is "ever so slightly out of alignment", althought it is not really noticeable unless you actually take a tape to it. My question is should I go with hardy plank or vinyl? I know the plank cost is more than the vinyl, but I want the house to look as good as it can so I can put it up for sale and get out of hurricane country. The house is very structurally sound after alot of repairs. Would hardy plank make it any stronger? Do you have any suggestions?
Thanks
 
Posts: 4 | Registered: 30 September 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Siding will not materially add strength to the house. The biggest difference between fiber-cement plank (such as Hardy plank) and vinyl siding is in the apparent shadow line created under each course. Because of its weight, fiber-cement plank is made considerably thinner (almost half) than corresponding wood plank, and therefore also the vinyl siding that imitates the wood. Take a good look at a fiber-cement siding installation in all light conditions and make your own decision as to the appearance. It's a matter of curb appeal, especially when you contemplarte selling the house in the near future.


Architect (NY) and Home Designer (PA)
 
Posts: 2870 | Location: Tobyhanna, PA | Registered: 24 October 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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One caution with the HARDIE PLANK WE USED IT NEW CONSTRUCTION, PROFESSIONALLY INSTALLED, PROFESSIONALLY PAINTED. THE PLANK IS CHALKING, THE PAINT IS BUBBLED & PEELING OFF NOT HAPPY WITH IT FOR THESE REASONS.
BOB
 
Posts: 2 | Registered: 31 January 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I'm not sure one can blame the siding for the paint problems. Maybe something got spilled on this particular batch, or maybe it's a bad batch for some reason, but to accurately place blame, one would have to know in detail what primer was used, what the temperature was when it was applied, whether the siding was dry or wet, and what type of paint was used, with all the same questions about the finish coat. And most importantly, were the siding manufacturer's and the paint manufacturer's written instructions followed to the letter. Were the primer and paint products of the same manufacturer? The questions keep popping up. I've seen paint peel from cedar siding also...who would we blame there, the trees?


Architect (NY) and Home Designer (PA)
 
Posts: 2870 | Location: Tobyhanna, PA | Registered: 24 October 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Hardie boad comes pre primed. Sherwin Williams is the recomended paint. We have paint problems on many areas of the house. I do not think all the problem boards came from one "tree".
 
Posts: 2 | Registered: 31 January 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Sounds as if you all answered the question. If you do not have to "Paint" then you do not have to worry about it peeling. Siding does not make the house stronger, it is the framing and sheathing that supports the siding. Fiber Cement is very vunerable to cracking when impacted by anything, ask the guys that install it, it breaks in thier hands when they handle it and cracks if the hit it with thier hammer.
You should take a look at the Thermal Composite cladding options. You will get an R-Value, High Impact Resistance,High Windloads, Straighter Walls and never have to argue about primers and paints. CedarMax 5/4"x6" x 16'2" Planking from Heartland was specified on a Golf Course community because it would not crack, splinter or flake when hit with a golf ball.
 
Posts: 3 | Location: NJ | Registered: 02 March 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I've had Hardi-Plank on my house for 8 years now. I repainted after 7, mainly because the builder paint job used 5 gallons for a three story house. I've not had any problem with peeling, chalking or damage to the Hardi-Plank. I've also installed Hardi-Panel and Hardi-Plank on several projects, it is heavy and causes a bunch of dust when you cut it. Other than that it isn't bad to install. One of the big advantages to Hardi-Plank and other fiber cement siding products is its resistance to fire. We had fire in our neighborhood and the house was a total loss, but the houses on both sides with about 20 feet between the homes were undamaged by the raging fire. With vinyl siding it is very common for fire to melt the siding off of the adjacent homes. There was a major fire here in the Raleigh area last week, wind driven brush fire hit a vinyl clad townhouse community and took out 27 recently built homes.

I suspect your paint problems have to do with moisture problems inside your house. A damp basement or crawlspace without a vapor barrier. The moisture works its way into the walls and causes premature paint failure. BTW my house was painted the first time with Sherwin Williams A-100 and the next time with Sherwin Williams Super Paint.
 
Posts: 28 | Location: Cary, NC | Registered: 02 March 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Siding doesn't add to the structural integrity of the house. That comes from bracing and cladding, such as plywood or OSB.

You have to decide about the appearance. Vinyl CAN look cheesey, in my opinion. I have no problem with the Hardee products. It comes in several profiles. And I think it is the hands-down winner in one sense - the 50 yr warranty.

The dust and brittleness are not your problem unless you are doing it yourself. If you are, they are a consideration.

ALL paint problems can be traced back to poor preparation, application, or paint quality. ALL of them. Painting is one area where you really get what you pay for. Do not blame the Hardee Plank: blame the painter (or the paint he used.
 
Posts: 1 | Location: Houston | Registered: 03 March 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Fiber Cement Company being sued by the Austrain Government? Aren't They an Australian Company? Banned in Australia? To many people getting sick? What about all the "Warnings" they ship with the product? What about the insurance companies that have disclaimers on the installers insurance policies? They will not cover you if you get sick from Fiber Cement?
You still have to paint it? and in 50 years replace it? To many question marks?
 
Posts: 3 | Location: NJ | Registered: 02 March 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Shark,
Can you provide some links to all these lawsuits against fiber cement and James Hardi? I googled fiber cement lawsuits and 4 pages into it I didn't come up with any lawsuits against Hardi-Plank. The only case against James Hardi was for asbestos use dating back to the 1920's. Modern Hardi-Plank doesn't contain asbestos. I have found numerous articles in trade pubs and newspapers singing the praises of fiber cement siding.

As far as replacing it in 50 years you don't have to replace it in 50 years that is the length of the warranty. How long is vinyl's warranty? My shingles have a 35 or 40 year warranty and I suppose some future owner will have to replace the roof on this house, will it be me? Probably not. I suspect vinyl will be long replaced by the time it would be 50 years old, especially the stuff that was put up 20 years ago.

Seems like Hardi-Plank "cladding" is still for sale in Australia. James Hardi - Australia

Still waiting for a few links to back up your claims.
 
Posts: 28 | Location: Cary, NC | Registered: 02 March 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I would also appreciate seeing some links to this information. I'm not familiar with 'Fiber Cement Company' mentioned by Sharkfinn, but I found no such problems associated with the James Hardie products. Any product that produces dust when you cut it can be hazardous and products containing fiber especially so. But, Hardie does not recommend that you use a saw to cut any of their products because of the dust generated. The reommended procedure is to use a scissors-type cutter available from several manufacturers (links at the Hardie site) or that you score it and snap it. If you absolutely have to use a saw, several companies make blades specifically designed for it. In any event, point source dust collection is recommended as is respiratory protection.
I am not a trade professional; I am a homeowner acting as my own GC for two additions being added to my house. To help the additions 'blend' in with the original structure, I resided the entire house at the same time as well as replaced all of the windows.
I live on the side of a mountain in Front Royal in the Shenandoah Valley. It's all wooded. I chose HardiPlank because of the 8 hour fire rating, 120 mile/hour wind rating, 50 year warranty. In addition, hands down, it just looks better than vinyl. I'm a single dad with custody of my 3 kids and the siding has easily tolerated everything they've thrown at it.
 
Posts: 7 | Location: Front Royal, VA | Registered: 04 March 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Shark,
Inquiring minds are still waiting for some proof to back up your claims against Fiber Cement Siding.
 
Posts: 28 | Location: Cary, NC | Registered: 02 March 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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ving thier product. If you could spend less money to clad the outside of your house within the most realistic Architectural Color Pallet that will last a lifetime and increase the "R" value which will pay for the entire siding job overtime.Why would you settle for as some else mentioned re-paint! (Put a $pricetag there! Not to mention "CHEAP BUILDER"! IN HIS MENTION")So " Cheap Paint, Cheap Primer, Bad "Perm Ratings". As we say in Joisey! Not upset about ya comin back at me wit da website thing. But I Googled "James Hardie Fiber-Cement Lawsuit" The pages keep on running.....DUH!(Had to Trowdatin!) All fun and games until somebody looses an eye or get's sick from Silicosis! Smiler
 
Posts: 3 | Location: NJ | Registered: 02 March 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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There are pages of websites if you google lawsuits and fiber cement BUT none of them are AGAINST fiber cement, most were against Masonite siding and recommending replacement with fiber cement. I find your claim that the energy savings from your product will pay for it highly dubious. The product you mentioned does look nice but Hardi Plank is a solid product with a proven track record.

Your product might be very good but there is no need to slam an excellent product to promote your own. You have made several unsubstantiated claims against James Hardi Products including that it is banned for sale in Australia, and that they are being sued. I see that their products are still for sale in Australia and all the law suit data is against other products and Hardi-Plank is a recommended product to replace the original siding. If the product were so bad the first page on google would be nothing but lawsuits against the product. I will freely admit I didn't go beyond the first 3 pages looking for something to back up your claims before I gave up since I didn't find anything to support your claims. Frankly that the product needs painting every 8-10 years if you don't get the prepainted stuff isn't bad, I changed the color of my house after 7 years because I grew tired of the original color. Painting vinyl is possible but why? It ruins the "maintenance free" aspect of vinyl.
 
Posts: 28 | Location: Cary, NC | Registered: 02 March 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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has anybody ever tried to cement render hardy plank, we are about to buy a house with hardy plank siding and my wife hates it, any tips????
 
Posts: 1 | Registered: 13 January 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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I am president of a 10-unit condo complex association that used Hardie board cement siding when the units were constructed. We started having problems with chalking, bubbling and paint peeling after about three years. We are in a tough environment (northeast Wisconsin) but have been fighting with James Hardie Company for the past two years over this. They state it was improperly installed but there are problem areas that have nothing to do with alleged improper installation. Interestingly, we did a little research and founf they changed their installation instructions three times in about a 5-year period of time. Think they've had problems? Hmmmm...
 
Posts: 1 | Registered: 03 June 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Its funny that you said this.

When the EIFS systems started having issues with their siding many siding companies started to look into their siding installations as well.
They found that most had the same issues with water seepage, rot and mold flaking etc. Reason being the installation contractor failed to install systems with proper flashing details.

This begins with correct installation of the house wrap. Not being properly overlapped, sealed and correctly installed around doors and windows.
Then the flashings not being installed over windows, doors, kick outs by gutters. Not installing flashings under the ends where they butt against each other.
Not caulking the seams where they meet the corners and around the windows and doors.
Then the nailing patterns were also issues with the sidings. Not properly nailing into structure instead nailing into the sheathing material that does not properly hold.

All manufactures upgrade their installation methods as they see fit. They do so to address issues with improper installation methods found in the field.

You must understand. Not so long ago there were real craftsmen installing siding. Now a guy with a truck, ladder, saw, hammer and a few half-wits are doing the job as sub-contractors with the general contractors and homeowners not watching or understanding how this stuff is supposed to be installed. All they care about is the bottom line, not having it done right. Once its on, painted it looks just like a job that should have been done correctly so no one knows until its discovered that there are issues. At that time the only person around is the manufacture who gets the blame because dumb-wit is now out of business.

I am sorry about your issue with the siding. But the only person who is to blame with this stuff is the person who put it on and the person who agreed to pay the least amount to get the job done.

Your not alone with this. Many vinyl siding owners, wood siding owners, EIFS siding owners, traditional stucco owners, and not to leave out brick sided building owners have the same issues with decay, rot and damage. Reason being. NOT ONE OF THE INSTALLATION CONTRACTORS KNEW HOW TO PROPERLY FLASH AND INSTALL THE PRODUCTs they installed! When I confront them as an independent inspector the first thing they say is I do not know what I am talking about, that they have been installing this type of siding for years this way and never had any issues. Yea right, by me being on the job site is because they are not doing it right. They just have not had anyone blame them for doing it wrong.

This is not to lay blame only on the installer of the product. The manufactors are to blame as well. They should not be selling their products to over the counter companies that are not certified by them to install their products. This is why the EIFS class action law suits were won. Not because the product is or is not faulty, but because they did not have proper oversite of the product being installed which in almost every case was done wrong. This resulted in the manufactures (or at least the better ones) requiring contractors to sit through classes as well as in the case of Hardi, changing their way of installing their products to counter all the sub-quality installers out there.

This issue will continue as manufactures come out with better methods of install of their products and better ways to convince the general public to only have their certified installers place their product on your walls. But that cost money and no one wants to spend any to do the job right. This is why all you can find are a handfull of quality contractors doing the job right and a boat load of guys who think they are doing it right but have no clue what their doing.
This point I am making can be clearly seen with the recent laws requiring ALL contractors in the US to be certified in doing work on homes that contain lead. Every one is up and arms about not having enough time to get certified before this past April deadline. HELLO, this law was on the books for almost three years. Almost all of your better contractors who know their job got the schooling required before this deadline. Those who do not have a clue but claim to know everything are pitching a fit saying they did not have enough time to be certified and plan to continue to do work without this very important certification that the law requires. These are the very people who claim to know how to install the siding on your development as well as others across the country.
Good luck with your issues.
 
Posts: 1933 | Location: New Jersey | Registered: 31 January 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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    boards.hgtvremodels.com    HGTVRemodels Message Boards  Hop To Forum Categories  Best Practices  Hop To Forums  Exterior Finishes    Hardy plank vs. Vinyl siding.